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Photograph - George Pyrich - 11-05-2013
The following is intended as a series of comments rather than questions.
Maybe I’m becoming out of touch as I become older but, in the age of this celebrity culture thing, is it now considered to be acceptable for someone to be photographed whilst standing smiling at someone’s graveside?
I refer to the photograph of Andrew Muir which adorns the front cover of the recent edition of our Scottish Chess magazine. I know many people like to have pictures taken whilst visiting some tourist site or other (I’ve done this myself) but have we really reached the stage where someone’s grave is to be treated as if were just another such tourist site? Perhaps others may disagree but I find this to be both disrespectful and tasteless. Pictures of the graves of Alekhine, Capablanca and others have been published in numerous sources and indeed pictures Fischer’s headstone and grave have also been provided in various publications (New in Chess provided one not so long ago) but this?
These comments are in no way intended as criticisms of either Peter Woods who provides us with an excellent magazine or Andrew who is to be commended upon his achievements in Iceland (I’ve actually voted for him in the ballot for CS Player of the Year). As I say, these are just comments.
Re: Photograph - Andrew McHarg - 11-05-2013
Personally I don't see a problem with it, given the circumstances (assuming it's the Fischer grave visit you're talking about).
When famous people die their funerals are largely broadcast for the world to see (Thatcher for instance) - and it's not a new phenomenon. Fischer died a long time ago and I'd imagine taking a photograph next to his grave is no different to taking a picture of someone standing next to a war memorial. The very purpose of a grave is to commemorate a person and a photograph of that grave is really only an extension of this. It's not like Andy was viewing a grave and personally grieving, where this could be an upsetting intrusion for him.
Re: Photograph - andyburnett - 11-05-2013
I tend towards George's view on this.
Besides, I'm not sure I could even raise a smile at anyone's graveside, certainly not for a photo. I've always found them to be places for solemn reflection (but perhaps that's just me).
P.S. Sorry for going off on a tangent, but I do actually recall smiling once at a graveside some years ago. We were wandering through a cemetery in Armagh, NI. The caretaker came up to us and we got chatting about England's football team losing for the umpteenth time on penalties the previous evening (us amused, him disappointed). He immediately motioned us over to a particular grave and headstone.
"Do you know who this man was?" he asked.
"No idea", I replied.
"You'd have liked him - this is the grave of the man who first introduced penalties as a way of deciding football matches!"
Anyway, quite amusing, but I don't think it would have made a good photo opportunity for the front page of 4-4-2 or Match of the Day
Re: Photograph - amuir - 12-05-2013
The visit to Bobby's grave was deemed acceptable by the organisers. They arranged the bus trip with about 50 people on it. I like to smile in most photographs. It was an honour of me to visit Bobby's grave - I have spoken to Anatoly ,Garry & Vishy in real life but not Bobby and this was the closest I could get to him.
Re: Photograph - George Pyrich - 14-05-2013
I'm sure that thousands of people have visited Fischer's grave since his passing in order to pay their respects. Doubtless many of these were in organised parties, large and small - many have perhaps also taken photographs, some of which have found their way into various publications. However, to have your picture taken beside anyone's grave, smiling or otherwise, is, in my opinion, disrespectful.
Evidently we hold different opinions on the matter.
Re: Photograph - amuir - 14-05-2013
Any chessplayer is welcome to visit my grave when I die. Photos for publication in the magazine/flowers/prayers accepted. My daughter Katherine is in charge of my burial.
Re: Photograph - George Thomson - 14-05-2013
George Pyrich Wrote:I'm sure that thousands of people have visited Fischer's grave since his passing in order to pay their respects. Doubtless many of these were in organised parties, large and small - many have perhaps also taken photographs, some of which have found their way into various publications. However, to have your picture taken beside anyone's grave, smiling or otherwise, is, in my opinion, disrespectful.I take it that you did not participate in the Party in George Square Glasgow to celebrate the passing of the wicked witch of the south?
Evidently we hold different opinions on the matter.
Re: Photograph - George Neave - 14-05-2013
George Thomson Wrote:George Pyrich Wrote:I'm sure that thousands of people have visited Fischer's grave since his passing in order to pay their respects. Doubtless many of these were in organised parties, large and small - many have perhaps also taken photographs, some of which have found their way into various publications. However, to have your picture taken beside anyone's grave, smiling or otherwise, is, in my opinion, disrespectful.I take it that you did not participate in the Party in George Square Glasgow to celebrate the passing of the wicked witch of the south?
Evidently we hold different opinions on the matter.
In my opinion that was much worse. I am sure Andy's smile is motivated by nothing other than excitement to be paying homage to a great chess player and is not an act to celebrate someone's passing which reflects badly on anyone sad enough to behave in such a way. I expect there are many who would consider Mr Fischer's political outlook much worse than that of the lady who's passing was being celebrated in Glasgow in this way.
Re: Photograph - andyburnett - 14-05-2013
George Neave Wrote:George Thomson Wrote:George Pyrich Wrote:I'm sure that thousands of people have visited Fischer's grave since his passing in order to pay their respects. Doubtless many of these were in organised parties, large and small - many have perhaps also taken photographs, some of which have found their way into various publications. However, to have your picture taken beside anyone's grave, smiling or otherwise, is, in my opinion, disrespectful.I take it that you did not participate in the Party in George Square Glasgow to celebrate the passing of the wicked witch of the south?
Evidently we hold different opinions on the matter.
In my opinion that was much worse. I am sure Andy's smile is motivated by nothing other than excitement to be paying homage to a great chess player and is not an act to celebrate someone's passing which reflects badly on anyone sad enough to behave in such a way. I expect there are many who would consider Mr Fischer's political outlook much worse than that of the lady who's passing was being celebrated in Glasgow in this way.
I have no problem with those who partied when Thatcher died - I would have joined them if I'd been able to. She was a repulsive human being and her views weren't that much different from Fischer's, but at least there were probably mental health reasons for his actions and statements.
If Andy wants to smile for a pic at Fischer's grave then that's his business - others feel differently which is fine too. I don't think it was the best choice for the front cover of CS magazine, but it's not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things.
Re: Photograph - Geoff Chandler - 15-05-2013
Hi
I believe I may have been one of the first to publish Bobby's grave on the net.
Then it was not a tourist attraction and off the beaten track.
Here is how I wrote about it on The Corner
"I was going to close there but a friend of a friend who was recently
touring Iceland persuaded the coach tour driver to make a 20 minute detour
to visited Bobby's grave.
I was sent the picture and was at first very reluctant to post it.
But I figured if not me then someone else would. At least I'm doing it
because I loved the guy and it's done with nothing but affection.
I also know 99% of the people who surf here are true chess fans and
will see nothing ghoulish in this. I hope nobody feels offended."
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.chessedinburgh.co.uk/chandlerarticle.php?ChandID=269">http://www.chessedinburgh.co.uk/chandle ... handID=269</a><!-- m -->
So you can see I was a wee bit worried about this, (It's not quite Corner material is it?)
But I'm with Andy Burnett and can see no problem with AM's picture.
I've since then seen 6 or 7 on the net most with smilling faces.
However I can also see and understand George's point.
It's personal and everyone will have their own take on it.
On the cover of a National Magazine?
Yes. Why not? There was certainly no disrespect intended.