Glorney Teams

[Andy Howie]

Harry,

Looking at the Olympiad team.

Andy Muir has coached our juniors for free as has Alan Tate so this is happening

[Andrew McHarg]

Stokes

England
Golding, Alex 1752 
Moreby, James E 1496 
Willow, Jonah B 1810 
Ahluwalia, Amardip 1645 
Davies, Alexander 1464 
Howell, Oliver W 1485
Average: 1608

Ireland
Byrne, Alex 1599 
Li, Henry 1884 
O`Gorman, Tom 1666 
Dwyer, Daniel 1429 
Gallagher, Matthew 1319 
Haque, Mustakim-Ul 1234 
Average: 1522

Scotland
Volland, Ben 1273 
Richmond, Liam 1243 
Berera, Siddharth 1088 
Hartman, James 857 
Harper, Sam 974 
Campbell, Michael 983 
Average: 1070

Our Stokes team were outgraded by more than 400 elo on average against Ireland and England. Sometimes you just have to congratulate your opponents and say that they had the better teams.

I agree that we can learn from what other nations are doing. But I disagree that we need to "look seriously" at our selection procedures. It would not have mattered which team we sent in the Stokes, they would have been heavily outgraded. And, having seen our coaching set up, I am confident that it's heading in the right direction. The rate of improvement of many of our players is highly encouraging. I really don't think we can look at a couple of 6-0 defeats in isolation and suggest everything is a complete disaster. Those matches were closer than the scorelines would suggest. Learn lessons... absolutely. But coaching takes time; so let's give it time.

[harrymarron]

Good for them. It does seem a bit ad hoc though. We need something more than a bit of goodwill from one or two players Andy. What about a policy? A Development Plan for Juniors? Operational procedures including written contracts in terms of how its going to happen, with senior top level players putting something back into the game and not charging for it? I believe there are too many people looking out for themselves and contributing little or nothing. They have been afforded great opportunities to represent their country all over the world, partly subsidised through and by ChessScotland and there should be a payback. The membership should be demanding more and the officials should be providing more.

[Andy Howie]

Officials should be providing more???

How much more of my time do you want me to devote to Chess in Scotland? (I am glad my wife can't read this...)

[Clement Sreeves]

Good for them. It does seem a bit ad hoc though. We need something more than a bit of goodwill from one or two players Andy. What about a policy? A Development Plan for Juniors? Operational procedures including written contracts in terms of how its going to happen, with senior top level players putting something back into the game and not charging for it? I believe there are too many people looking out for themselves and contributing little or nothing. They have been afforded great opportunities to represent their country all over the world, partly subsidised through and by ChessScotland and there should be a payback. The membership should be demanding more and the officials should be providing more.

I don't see any reason why the top players should be forced to provide free coaching. They have devoted tens of thousands of hours and invested a lot of their own money to get good at a game which quite frankly, isn't the most rewarding financially.

[harrymarron]

The hyper sensitivity and defensiveness of some people on this noticeboard continues to astound me. Andrew McHarg thanks for backing up my viewpoint that we were totally outclassed in the Stokes Cup (the ratings prove my point that we need to provide better and greater volume of free coaching). Who will provide it though? Not Clement it would seem :-)

[Alex Gillies]

I have no issue with added value paid for coaching - its not hugely expensive and worth at least a few sessions to see if works - the coaches all seem to offer both free and paid training - its more like expenses money than earnings I would have thought anyway

I think I have already suggested they could be paid sessions as prizes for top juniors in each section

I would be against compelling free training but agree it can be improved upon. Chess for kicks etc bring through volume of promising youngsters - there is a gap after the top few

You could encourage youngsters to clubs for free training or talks such as Richard Cochrane's at Paisley and a few others at various other clubs. The stokes gap is a worry - they probably need more exposure at tougher tournaments and less exposure at chess for kicks type events once the potential is identified.

[Jonathan Edwards]

The hyper sensitivity and defensiveness of some people on this noticeboard continues to astound me. Andrew McHarg thanks for backing up my viewpoint that we were totally outclassed in the Stokes Cup (the ratings prove my point that we need to provide better and greater volume of free coaching). Who will provide it though? Not Clement it would seem :-)

If you compare, for example, the England Stokes cup side with the all time Scotland junior ratings; 3/6 of their players would be FIRST in the relevant age lists. I think this shows that not only were we "totally outclassed" in this particular year, but their team is genuinely excellent. There are plenty of coaches who provide free coaching for Scottish juniors, by the way, and this includes our countries' top players as well (and Clement just gave free coaching at the Glorney).

[Andrew McHarg]

They have devoted tens of thousands of hours...

Oh man I've got a long way to go! #:-s

[Jacqui Thomas]

Interesting read through the comments but I have some points I would like to make.

How come parents are willing to pay out hefty fees for music lessons, martial arts, swimming etc but not for chess?

There is something missing somewhere. There doesn't seem to be any recognition in chess. Like wow you have been selected to play chess for Scotland! Think of the buzz in Glasgow & in the media for the Commonwealth games but what did we see or hear about the commonwealth chess championships? We didn't even get told which Scottish juniors had been selected to play. Is it perceived as 'just a game'' & has no more value than tiddlywinks? I don't have any answers..... Just saying.

Referring back to an old post of mine...... Donna as IJD ran junior squad coaching days. A fee was charged to be part of the Junior Squad (£20) I think. I assume the fee covered the cost of venue & coach expenses. We know Hamilton used to run coaching days & although excellent coaches are there the take up tended to be from the lower graded juniors.

Perhaps if there were willing organisers & coaches who would commit to it there could be say three National Junior coaching days organised but run in three different areas. Ie: Glasgow, Edinbugh, Perth. A fee charged individually but anyone wishing to commit to all 3 would be discounted. It could even be promoted as a variant of the junior CS membership. Instead of magazine membership it could be junior squad membership. (To make it more attractive to the junior not the parents wallet it could include tshirt & cs items including training books & score pad). Would it work? I don't know. If I'm honest I don't think there is enough commitment from the juniors & there is such a thin line of making the game a chore rather than fun.

It is true juniors would benefit from talks as presented by Richard at Paisley. I happened to be there last week & there was only one junior in attendance. This was free, well presented & ideal pace for all levels but only one junior??? So maybe more thought needs to go into junior set up as a whole because if they were interested in receiving coaching why aren't the local ones attending these type of sessions? Maybe they are not getting the right advice or getting communications about them, maybe they don't want to take the game that seriously.bAs the notice board is mostly closed off maybe these events should get better promotion on the home page with more info & guidance so parents know that it might benefit their child.

I agree with a lot that has been said in this thread regarding the Stokes team but also Liverpool where England especially don't put out their best juniors. Scotand under 12's have always been the under dogs within the four nations. Is it right to expose those juniors to that level? Does it help their game? Or does it put them off? I guess a bit of both depending on the child.

I think this subject needs more than a notice board thread to discuss. Perhaps the junior board could take it forward.

Footnote: SJC aim & purpose is to provide events for juniors from grassroots. It has never been the purpose to expand to junior international level. When the junior outgrows Chess for Kicks they should already be playing in the main congresses. Although we do have a couple of events that are open & suitable for all juniors.